John Piper On The Prosperity Gospel

[ScottL]

Here is a video from the passionate John Piper on his dislike of the prosperity gospel.

Any thoughts on this video?
Do you agree?
Do you disagree?
Any specific points from Piper stick out most to you?

[Kim]

I agree with him, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it Scott. The overlapping of the 2 kingdoms stuck out as I watched it with you in mind , don't know why it stuck out, but it did. I agree with him in regards to prosperity gospel which is what he was addressing.

[Rey Reynoso]

I agree. I like that he touched it on several levels so that it gets more deep and more dangerous. There's just no good way to swim those waters.

[Greg Smith]

I agree wholeheartedly. I wish Piper would give us a book about this. Something that could be handed to a prosperity gospel person that would help them see the error of their message.

[Craig Falvo]

It's probably one of the few things I'll agree with Piper on.

[Raquel]

love it.

[Otsukafan]

I like this one.

[Harry]

Or this:

[ScottL]

Oh goodness, now the thread has turned into 'post your favourite Piper video'. :)

I agree with it. I embrace suffering to enter the kingdom, suffering in a fallen world. Of course, I do believe God wants to bless - He's just that kind of a gracious and giving God, and it is so abundant. But those kind of statements now have to be qualified in light of the prosperity teaching.

Kim, I'll have to go back and listen to his thoughts on the kingdom now and the kingdom to come (or however he words it). But I can't imagine disagreeing with his thoughts, at least thinking what he would be saying on that topic.

[H]

I agree also that the prosperity gospel is another gospel and that it is destroying people's lives. I find it repellent that Christians believe they can manipulate God into fulfilling the desires of their flesh. The Scriptures couldn't be more clear on role suffering plays in the life of the believer.

That said, I do believe God blesses his children. He is our Father and not a remote, disinterested deity; we are his sons and daughters. As the Scriptures also say, what father, though evil, does not know how to give good gifts to his children? God, being perfect, knows perfectly what is best for us; what will form Christ in us, and he will not withhold that which is good for us from us, whether it is suffering, help in time of trouble, grace to endure, or, yes, material blessings. All of us have been blessed with material goods by God; where else did they come from?

Yes, there are believers who are hungry and naked, but what that tells me is that the church (universal) and believers with much (us, despite our tight budgets) need to do is find a way to make this a priority and do something about it. I confess I don't know how, aside from giving money to an organization - and then what happens? I don't know. I don't know how many are truly helped. But for money/help to be directly funneled from a brother/sister here to a suffering brother and his family in some developing nation would be a blessing from God...

[xulon]

I don't get why non-charismatics are being portrayed as people who don't believe "God blesses his children". Is that what Piper says on the video?

[H]

No, I don't think he does; however, the idea of "blessing" has been so closely identified in some circles with twisting the Scriptures with regard to money and material things that a distinction may need to be made. I come from a Charismatic background but sidestepped the prosperity heresy. I'm merely explaining what my idea of blessing is because I don't subscribe to WOF/PG ideas.

Edited to clarify that I don't believe Piper is saying that God doesn't bless his children. I'm sure Piper believes that God is a generous and loving Father.

xulon said:

I don't get why non-charismatics are being portrayed as people who don't believe "God blesses his children". Is that what Piper says on the video?

[joanne guarnieri]

Sticking specifically to this topic, I agree with Piper. He is teaching against a particular brand of gospel that insists that material and physical blessing in this life is every believer's manifest destiny; it is a gospel that claims entitlement where it is not due. In fact, any sense of personal entitlement would be dangerous to the Christian mindset. Whereas God promises certain things to His children, those promises are based on His grace, His own loving and generous nature, and not on the merits of believers.

But clearly prosperity teaching has traction among believers not just because of our human natures, but because there has been at least a weakness, if not a gap, in the orthodox teachings of the church universal. What's the gap?