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I am not a full preterist, but partial. While I believe we have tasted of the age to come as new creations, I do not believe we have full entered the new heavens and new earth.
We all want to know what the Bible literally means, but we have to get into the culture, history, languages, and context to know what it literally means. Case and example - many can try and teach Ezekiel 1 speaks of UFO's or Jeremiah 10:1-5 speaks of Christmas trees, but in the end, that isn't what it is talking about.
The Jews had particular ways of describing things - very poetically, and very apocalyptically in regards to final things to come. By apocalyptic, I mean that they used a lot of symbols and imagery. So, if Revelation 12:1 speaks of a woman clothed with the sun, we aren't looking for the creation of a synthetic fiber in the 21st century that can capture the sun's rays, as some would speak of. Rather, we want to know what that image meant to first century Jewish Christians, still knowing it can and does speak to us today.
Again, I would encourage you to not pick up the newspaper or read articles to determine what Revelation is talking about. I would encourage you to consider that there is a gap culturally, contextually, linguistically, and historically between us and when the Scriptures were written. Then, begin to study the Word and how a first century Jew would think and let that help in understanding the Scripture. Do know I believe the Scriptures are the Word of God and important to us, but I must guard against reading a 21st century American viewpoint into a first century (or further back) middle-eastern, Jewish culture.
The answer is still no.
And I agree with JL on one of his rebuttal points, only one, You seem to be using the Newspapers to interpret scripture.
OH and Ladies with all due respect not being right on the book of Revelation is an important thing. The warning at the end of the book to those who would take away or add to the book of Revelation is a pretty serious warning so it would behoove us to make sure we are correct on the interpretation.
Andrew Talley said:John, Didn't Jesus give us signs to watch for his coming? Isn't it even remotely possible the disappearing honey bees & other pollinators could lead to the very situation Rev. 6:5-6 predicts when we consider that their disappearance is mysteriously unexplainable? Doesn't it intrigue you that the four food groups listed in Rev. 6:5-6 are all wind pollinated? Do you realize that if the problem isn't corrected very soon (some say a ten year window of which 4 or 5 have already expired) the only crops we will have left will be wind pollinated crops? It looks awfully suspicious to me! Have you read the article on my web page about the disappearing honey bees?
John J Travers III said:Like JL I have given a lot of thought and study to this and while I differ with him on many points I am in agreement on the answer to your question.
It is absolutely 100% without a shadow of doubt No. Even at face value the events described in Revelation of the horse and riders are not subtle. They are like a hammer hitting a nail.
Char -- yea! We agree!
OK, my two cents worth...not that it is worthy much and I well expect it to be shot down by this group. But that's OK.
I wish we would focus on the central message of Revelation instead of getting bogged down into the speculative nature of the book. The fact is: Revelation teaches us that God is in control. God is Sovereign. He has a plan for the end of all time. This is the central message of Revelation.
John wrote the book to give hope to those being persecuted. God gave him a vision to communicate to the masses at that time....to give hope. They were dying...being persecuted. God gave Him a beautiful message to reassure them that He is in control. It absolutely must be put in historical perspective. Absolutely, it holds significance today. However, I don't believe it was ever John's purpose for us to take every creature, bowl and horse literally. Apocalyptic literature is written this way....in a lyrical way.....to give hope...to disguise its meaning from contemporaries (much as Jesus did through His parables) .....to encourage us to understand that God is on the throne and we will ultimately reign with Him, sitting at His feet in awe...worshipping HIM. It encourages us to persevere through tribulation.
I wonder....all the time spent worrying about horses and creatures and timetables....how much better could that time be spent actually getting to know the God you love and worship? If you trust Him, you won't be possessed with the details of the end times. You will, however, spend more time worshiping Him....honoring Him....trusting Him....learning about HIM in the Word, not focusing all your efforts on theoretical and controversial future events. End times is a distraction that need not be so.
I recently finished a class on Revelation taught by a late 70s woman (reformed pastor's wife). What amazing insight she had! She could draw on all of her years of experience and learning. She is a brilliant and well-educated woman. To see her so succinctly capsulize the central message of Revelation totally rocked my world. I now see it clearly....with no questions....with no desire to knit-pick it apart for my own minds' security and curiousity.
OK - have at it....but I think a balance was needed in this conversation. Yell at me all you want.....you can tell I lean amil. I wasn't always so. Now....it is the only one that makes sense to me. The only real view that has given me perfect peace. BTW - I won't be arguing with you! Somehow I see God shaking His head....thinking to Himself.....can they see ME through all of their wanderings and speculations? Where is their focus, anyway? Just being honest with you.......have fun...
The problem is war, not the disappearance of pollinators. Famine follows behind the red horse of war, just as Jesus said famine would follow war in (Mt 24:7).