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Ray Carsjens
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Roman Catholics are th...
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Apostles, Do they Exis...
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Revelation when was it...
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The Church Fathers vie...
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The Trinity: What is ...
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Ray Carsjens's Discussions
Further Revelation
Replied Oct. 21, 2008
Covenant Theology or Dispensational Theology?
Replied Jul. 7, 2008
Further Revelation
Replied Jul. 4, 2008
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I assure you nothing is cut and pasted. I prefer to give evidence and not others words.
The last days were for Israel not the Newer Church, as stated by Johns letter it is the last time, and that concluded in 70 AD. Have a nice day.
Please list evidentially, why you believe the dateing of Revelation regardless to when you believe it was written. 90 AD, 96 A.D. or Before 70 A.D. 63 A.D. Etc
Ray -
Scott I have never heard of a partial Preterist that claimed we are still in the last days since 70AD. On the contrary most Partial Preterists I know believe that 70AD ended the last days with Christs Presence being ushered in at the destru...
a) Eusebius (AD 324; Ecclesiastical History, 3:18:4), tells us that Christians and secular writers alike wrote of a time of persecution during the end of Domitian’s reign, namely the 15th year of his reign (AD 95-96) and that the former (for examp...
A place we can show with documented evidence why we believe what we do. What The Church Fathers Believed.
Truth runs through out History.
Many to day claim that Apostles Exist Today like Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, 7th Day Adventists and Roman Catholics etc. Whats your view.
Please list evidentially, why you believe the dateing of Revelation regardless to when you believe it was written. 90 AD, 96 A.D. or Before 70 A.D. 63 A.D. Etc
Your theory that Johns Rev had the late date for 1800 years is not correct, it at best is only one statement by Irenaeus, and was never deemed a evidencial statement for the fact that it is so obscure. The others that are witnesses to it are just ...
Ray -
We've been in the last days for almost 2,000 years.
I lean towards an amillenial and/or partial preterist view. But I do note that some early church fathers say John's writing of Revelation as a later date, as in the 90's AD - i.e. what pe...
Well its not why all of a sudden Remember it is 180 yrs old. The validity of why now is easy, The southern Baptists when believeing that this was an old doctrine newly revealed accepted and claimed that it was an old key to understanding Eschatolo...
Well this is important to discuss, because if you have no relative understanding in the past then it falls into a catagory of New Revelation, Which there is only new revelation as in , to the person doing a study for the first time, there isnt new...
Dave -
For starters, I am not arguing for a pre-trib rapture or not. I am just providing some general thoughts to your question.
I think it would come to down to the argument that, if no one held a particular belief prior to a certain date (i.e....
To give the names for all those pretribulationalists before 1800 AD.
Not just pre mellenialists, but provable Pre Tribulationalists, Pre 1800AD
I don't understand the importance of discussing if there are/were those who believed in the pre-tribulational rapture of the church. Shouldn't the question instead be "Is this teaching scriptural or not?" and then debate the merits of that view ra...
Many to day claim that Apostles Exist Today like Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, 7th Day Adventists and Roman Catholics etc. Whats your view.
A place we can show with documented evidence why we believe what we do. What The Church Fathers Believed.
Truth runs through out History.
Though we can never equate God by a mathimatical problem I think for a small comprehensive meaning we could almost safly say GOD is not 1+1+1=3 but is more like 1X1X1=1 RC Scrolls
Dear brother,
I reviewed every reference you gave me, and to be perfectly honest nowhere does it state or refer to any apostles except the ones I noted. They are disciple, coworker, colaborers, etc. Barnabas, for example (one of your examples) is ...
There were only thirteen apostles,
there will never be any more than that. Unless you wish to include Paul, then there would be a total of fourteen. They were especially hand-picked by Christ. None can make that claim today, none.
Many to day claim that Apostles Exist Today like Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, 7th Day Adventists and Roman Catholics etc. Whats your view.
Profile Information
- Tell us about yourself
- I spent 6 yrs of Study in Toronto for Theology n Apologetics and another 4 yrs in England. And somewhere I have allways studied for atleast four hours aday 6 days aweek. And was blessed enough to Spend 8 yrs of every Day studie on one topic, Eschatology, not just a simester on the topic like at collage and Universties. My spelling has always been bad in English please forgive me for that, not my native Tongue. And yes I speak in tongues that many understand.
- How would you describe yourself theologically?
- Historical Preterist. This is a culmination of most full preterists and Partial Preterists with being Amillenialist, or as I like to say Millenial Now. As Amillenialism in Greek means No Millenial. Was a Dispensationalist pretriber (24yrs) until I started questioning what that meant. And they couldnt answer or gave me answers that I knew were wrong. The first hint was that the Temple is mentioned in REV 11 and yet its destroyed, so I questioned the Dating of REV, also They still claim that Christ can come back at anytime, which makes no sense in their own doctrine you see 2Thess ch 2 Says that the Day of the Lord shall not come until That man of sin is identified. They hold atleast pre tribers that they will be gone, I guess while Jesus is Here.That tells me that they dont know what they believe, again you have to have a Temple Physical for their God to Come. Its never going to happen, just try and get the billion Musslims to give up the Dome of the rock, Mosque, oh and then you have to have a pure red Hiefer to purify the grounds with its ashes and all the original Temple toys, Fakes and duplicates dont work, Ark of the Covenant which is not here! and a priest hood etc. I am sure Glad I have my Temple of the Holy Spirit in Me, and my Ultimate Temple King Jesus. I took 8 yrs and put all I had learnt aside. Took all the scriptures that Everyone said were realated to Eschatology and memorized them .
After eight years of study and I mean 10 to 12 Hours aday 7 days a week. I came to a very different conclusion. Then with alittle more study I found that I was not alone in my Beleifs, there was so much evidence of my view in History that I am settled in my spirit finally. The evidence is overwhelminly not a dispensational view or pretrib, Mid trib, or post Trib, well unless you say that the Trib was in 63-70AD. Then Well Maybe a Rapture. I ask all Dispensensationalists How I could by My own lengthy study come up with something that they say is so far out but yet I have such a great multitute of witnesses and writings for two thousand yrs, and yet they are confined to 180 years of Evangilastic Sensational Charismaniacs As Hank has stated. Tim LaHaye said in the times mag that Dispensationalism is cracking all around, but that He owes Tyndale house four more Books, and He will let the people decide how they think it all ends. Wont even givin and let His followers know that its over. A wolf in Sheeps clothing. Well I am going to state this, that dispensationalism will be known as a time when so many Christians bought into a lie, and barely escaped with their smoking Souls, and this I assure you will come to pass in Probably 10 to 20 yrs. Pray for the Persiverance of the Saints.
Love in Christ Jesus RC
- Who is the greatest theologian in the last 2000 years? (Besides Biblical People!)
- King Jesus
Ray Carsjens's Blog
What the Church believed before 1830 AD The Rest of the Story rcscrolls@aol.com
Matt. 10:23 - "Truly I say to you, you will not finish going through the cities of Israel until the Son of Man comes."
1. Matt. 16:28 - "Truly I say to you, there are some who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."
2. Matt. 24:34 - "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place." (Jesus' use of "this generation" throughout the gospels always refers to his contemporaries: 26:36; 11:16; 1… Continue
1. Matt. 16:28 - "Truly I say to you, there are some who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."
2. Matt. 24:34 - "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place." (Jesus' use of "this generation" throughout the gospels always refers to his contemporaries: 26:36; 11:16; 1… Continue
Posted on July 1, 2008 at 9:30pm — 2 Comments
Aproach a dispensationalist. Have them answer three questions about interpretation.
Here is one way, I believe the quickest way to aproach a dispensationalist, and to show them where contradiction is with their view.
useing just three scriptures. Matt 10:23, 16:28, and 26:64
Their response
In regards to Matt. 10:23, this is pertaining to the coming persecution in the tribulation days.
Matt 10:23, Mark 13:26 , Luke 21:27
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of ma… Continue
useing just three scriptures. Matt 10:23, 16:28, and 26:64
Their response
In regards to Matt. 10:23, this is pertaining to the coming persecution in the tribulation days.
Matt 10:23, Mark 13:26 , Luke 21:27
But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of ma… Continue
Posted on June 11, 2008 at 4:00pm —
Comment Wall (22 comments)
- At 4:02pm on October 21, 2008,
Jack said… - Rey; Agree with that post 100%! But hope Modbot doesn't jump you, Jack
- At 11:39pm on July 30, 2008,
Ray Carsjens said…
- Thanks Jim
- At 10:29pm on July 30, 2008,
JL Vaughn said… - Ray,
I went to StudyLight http://www.studylight.org/isb/bible.cgi?query=assembly§ion=0&it=kjv&oq=church&ot=lxx&nt=na&new=1 , entered assembly in the word search, and checked Septuagint in the search options.
Eclesia and synagogue are two of several Greek words translated assembly in the King Jimmy.
Blessings.
- At 6:53pm on July 30, 2008,
JL Vaughn said…
- Ray,
I don't know the original order of the OT books.
Because of details in the Septuagint version, I place Job at the time of Judges or possibly later.
Blessings
- At 6:59pm on July 11, 2008,
Rey Reynoso said… - Ah now I remember. there's just way too many convo's!
- At 12:01pm on July 10, 2008,
Rey Reynoso said…
- Huh?
- At 9:57am on June 27, 2008,
JL Vaughn said…
- Ray,
The first chapter of my book is on my website. BeyondCreationScience.com It might help.
I've attended a Presby or Reformed church a time or two. But I'm not of their mindset.
- At 10:45pm on June 26, 2008,
Ray Carsjens said…
- Did you ever know Walter Martin in the 70s or mid 80s before He died. My Dad was saved through His preaching at Melody land. When I told My Dad that Walter disclosed that Dispies were theologically destitute of Biblical Knowledge in Eschotology, He just through a fit, but its What Walter camr to a conclusion on in and /During His ministry. My Dad is still a dispensationalist and believes that I am eschewed in my Doctrine. He thinks that His view has been around since Paul. When I ask Him to tell me what certain scriptures mean and then give Him simple non theologically affected simple exegesis He cant even see it. Its just terrible that people are willing to stay so pridefull and stop learning. They have opend themselves to Subjectivity and can no longer see. I go to a Church here called Calvary Bible, not affiliated with the Chapel movement of Chuck Smith.My Pastor is a Mid Trib Guy that I give information to all the time, but He is really a great Guy. He teaches that we can all get along together, just as long as we are going to Church.
I do see such a big difference in Teaching though. I used to think that it didnt matter but latly Have come to the conclusion that it really does. If you think your in the last Days theres alot of confusion, Especially when the people who expound and ilaborate on it are totally in conflict with so many doctrinal views. Well you have a good week end and God bless. PS have you ever went to a Presbitarian Church, or Reformed.
- At 8:44pm on June 26, 2008,
JL Vaughn said…
- At the moment Anaheim First Christian.
I've been run off from several Churches of Christ and Christian Churches for preterism (covenant eschatology), covenant creation (Like all of Scripture, Genesis 1 is a historical event, not a prehistoric event), homeschooling, for having 5 children (who knew that God forbade such things), and having daughters who know more Scripture than the preacher.
We'll have to see. Unfortunately, it's pretty stressing for my wife. I have a friend in Taft who just got fired for being a preterist.
- At 7:52pm on June 26, 2008,
JL Vaughn said…
- Ouch Chemo. That will ruin your day.
My wife had cancer while pregnant, 19 years ago. We were asked to leave our church over that. We got an answer to prayer, and they missed out on the blessing.
We drive from Santa Ana to Fresno as often as we can. My wife's mother has pancreatic cancer and is not expected to see 2009.
I avoid places that require you to be dispensational or global flood. Those sorts usually don't even know what they believe.
Blessings.
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